Subject: [harryproa] Re: safely using Drogues and Para Anchors and mast materials
From: "Robert" <>
Date: 2/20/2006, 8:44 AM

I agree about being hit by a bit of green water from a curling wave.
It hurts. But is not common unless there is strong wind aganst tide
or close to shore with sudden shoaling.I've experienced tidal races
in PNG and would not like to experience those conditions with a
longer fetch Multihulls certainly cope well with their skinnier hulls
through such conditions
I've seen the wetting out of carbon at the Harryproa factory. the
details are on the website. The carbon tow is fully soaked and then
excess resin squeezed out. A sample of each run is weighed to check
the resin ratio. Subsequent vacuum bagging consolidated the
It is not so much strength but stiffness that is required, and I am
led to believe that a fair bit extra weight is required to get the
stiffnesss in glass

--- In, jerry freedomev <freedomev@y...>
>                Hi Robert and All,
> Robert <cateran1949@y...> wrote:    - ' misconception is the belief
that a breaking wave "strikes" the boat
> and that the moving water in the crest does the damage. Actually,
> boat is lifted by the forward face of the wave with no impact. When
> reaches the breaking crest the boat velocity is close to the wave
> velocity. The crest water is aerated and has little damage
> Damage to the boat is incurred when the boat is thrown ahead of the
> wave and impacts the green water in the trough. The leeward side
> the deck are struck.
>              I agree as unless a wave is curling, not likely in an
ocean unless the wind is against the current like our Fla Gulf
stream, curling waves rarely happen.
>             The facts are a wave was to curl, it just does it once
to get back to a reasonable wave face angle as a wave just can't
maintain that kind of angle needed to be dangerous. 
>             Only  in  tusnami's, fast currents against the wind do
these happen so likelyhood of one meeting on in open ocean is quite
small. Where your problems wil be is shallow waters where is is deep
next to it or with tidal, ocean currents, either of which you
shouldn't et to sea anchor but instead sail out of that area, out of
the current, shallows into safer water.
>              But our much higher speeds and superior hull shapes
make sailing out of these conditions fast and reasonably safe.
>    A careful reading of "Fastnet Force Ten"
>              Regretfully a company I worked for built at least 4 of
the boats , Admiral's cup boats, the ones that lost their carbon
fiber rudders and where I found out the disturbing details about just
how hard it is to reilably lay up CF as it's almost impossible to
know when it's been wet out as it doesn't change color like other
composite when wet out.
>            I rarely see a reason to use it and avoid it in my past
>            Have anyone tried using S glass and maybe Kevlar instead
of CF in the masts, ect instead of CF? With a little engineering like
slightly larger dia and a couple extra pounds would make up for the
lower strength at a much lower cost.
> and "Fatal Storm" will confirm this conclusion.' From the
> site
> This I do endorse from my own experience. I've never been hurt by
> water but have been hurt falling off waves onto green water.
>           I was almost killed by them in the Gulf Stream off Miami,
Fla when the wind came up from the north at 50 mph against the gulf
stream of 4 knots while we were in a 45' motorsailer mono. The waves
were 8-12' and breaking and about the same length apart as the boat
was long. We only survived by luck as the captain wouldn't get out of
the current because he didn't want to wet close to the shore parallel
with the current. After that I was much more picky with whom I
sailed !!
>          Yet in the same conditions off Ft Laud going to Martinque
for the Trophy De Multicoupe in the 60' racing cat, British Airways
captained by Robin-Knox Johnson, the famous single handed sailor.
>          We left Ft Laud with the wind at 50 mph against thecurent
and with the fifth reef in the main and most of the jib rolled up,
averaged  16kt acrossed the gulf stream, hitting 24 kt while I was at
the helm for a rather thrilling ride through breaking 12-16' seas.
Our speed, thin hulls kept the ride reasonably comfortable vs the
beating we took on the monohull.
>         So watch for those currents that might come against the
wind and if that's going top happen, get out of that current as fast
as you can.
>          As our boats are light, accelerate quickly they need a
very full bow so if they go into a wave trough, it will pop up
instead of going deeper into it. They also need it for sailing power
to windward and to prevent pitchpoling.
>                        Jerry Dycus
>   Robert
> ---------------------------------

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