|Subject: Re: [harryproa] Easy boatbuilding, Re: Attention australian builders|
|From: jerry freedomev |
|Date: 4/22/2007, 1:17 PM|
Hi Rob, Derek and All,
--- Rob Denney <firstname.lastname@example.org.
> Jerry, I copied your post to Derek and got the
> following reply. Feel free to answer his questions,
> but go easy on the strong language (ie refrain from
> using or implying "stealing" or similar terms) or
> your future posts will be edited by me or Michelle.
> WOW -
> The Jerry Dycus name rings a very, very faint bell,
> which I could not begin to put into any
> context and I have no idea what feature he is
> talking about.
You published it in I believe 76, in
Multihulls Mag. I probably still have the copy in my
Multihulls Mag collection somewhere. It was a 31-32'
open deck cat with all accommendations in the hulls,
like Tennant's racer/cruisers only earlier. I called
you from the US which cost quite a lot back then.
Stealing is a strong word. He
> must have been dwelling on this one for a long time.
It's close though, let's not get into sematics.
But like I said, it happens all the time, especially
in the boating world.
You could have at least mentioned my name as the
originator instead of making like it was just your
original idea was your only real obilgation.
My guess is I inspired you to bring plans out
since because of lead time on the mag, you would have
to have done it right away, within a couple weeks. And
you did not have anything like it at the time, you
It should be noted at the time. Multihulls were
a very, very small number, probably less that 5,000
western multihulls other than day cats. Almost
anything you did then was new.
I ended up building several like it to my
designs in tortured ply and in other sizes.
I looked at your website and didn't find it
> - though it seems I may have
> unwittingly done him a favor.
Let's admit it, at the time you were one of the
better known designers so it was a compliment to be
worth 'copying' from.
It told me that I could design it by myself just
as well which turned out to be correct and worked out
much better as I got just what I wanted in the
materials I wanted. That allowed me to build really
good, fast, safe, light, heavy load carrying
multihulls for about the same price as the laughable
Wharram cats of the time.
> Jerry - working on a flat table 25 years. Wonder
> where that idea came from? Bet he uses
> foam too.
Actually I used flat table, floor molds since
69 working for Wellcraft powerboat builders as one of
my first jobs here in Fla. And is common in the
boating industry before then as was cores.
Also Marina84 in Ft Laud Fla used a 80x20' flat
mold back then to build one off power yachts, later
ungraded to 120x20' when I worked there.
> So - Jerry, I am sorry if something that I did in a
> design was taken by you as taking an idea
> of yours. However, I can assure you I was/am not
> aware of it. You do not tell us what the
> feature was.
It was the complete design concept, set up,
not a single feature, to the T. We talked quite a
While I like flat tables, I like round bilge
for speed, lower drag, more pointy bottoms to cut
damage grounding so I moved on to tortured ply as it
took so little time, cash. And to sell boats you
needed both to make a profit. I do use them now to
make car parts, plugs, molds.
> There are a considerable number of boat builders
> using flat panels from a table. ( Lots of
> tables have been built in NZ and Australia since I
> came to NZ). However, KSS is a lot
> more than this. I could write a book on the step
> by step process we have gone through
> since building that first full size table in 1973.
> When resin infusion came in, it started a
> whole new line of refinements. It is rare for a
> workshop not to produce something new. It
> may be relatively minor but it all goes into the KSS
> I should also state - no I did not invent foam
> sandwich. It was my boats which put foam
> onto the map.
Not in the US. It was used here many yrs
earlier. Since you were about the first to build
multihulls in glass, maybe for them. The rest of us
were smart enough to build in wood on one offs!!!
Though FG cats definately sold better, wood/epoxy is
lighter, stronger, easier, lower cost.
The how was entirely my own work.
> No, I did not invent resin infusion.
> However, we have developed and refined the process
> out of all recognition to where we
> started. This has been directed for the way in
> which we use it.
> KSS addresses almost every task in boat building,
> where we can always produce the
> equivalent of any other design.
> And Jerry - let me have your address. I will send
> you a video. You really should give resin
> infusion a try. For work on a table, I do not
> believe you would ever want to go back. It
> changes the whole process. True there are times
> when you wonder at the set up time.
> However, once the resin taps are open and the whole
> full foam sandwich panel is infused
> half an hour later, there are no doubts whatsoever
> that it was all worth while and a lot
> quicker for any panel of any size. The hand
> laminating was the part I never looked forward
> to in the workshops. Now, it is all fun.
I'd be interested as I'm getting back into
composites building Electric vehicle body/chassis for
my soon to be in production EV.
I really don't have problems the way I do my
flat table layups but always interested in new
methods. A problem here is you don't have 30 minutes
for the resin to flow as it goes off in under 15
minutes in our Fla heat. I'll check to see if longer
time resins are available.
10011 Echo Mtn Dr
Riverview, Fla 33569 USA
> On time, resin infusion is not efficient for small
> solid glass panels. It is setting out all of the
> glass and foam dry and then infusing in one, which
> KSS belongs to Kelsall Catamarans.
> Best wishes,
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: jerry freedomev
> To: harryproa@yahoogrou
> Sent: Sunday, April 22, 2007 12:47 AM
> Subject: Re: [harryproa] Easy boatbuilding, Re:
> Attention australian builders
> Hi Rob and All,
> > Rob Denney wrote:
> > > G'day,
> > >
> >> >
> > > Most builders have read about the Kelsall KSS
> > technique
> > > http://www.kelsall.
> > > <http://www.kelsall.
> > building boats and
> > > wondered if it is really possible to build
> > this quickly. If
> > > they are, it makes a mockery of spending weeks
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