Subject: [harryproa] Re: HARRYPROA Extended to 13M
From: "Robert" <>
Date: 3/23/2008, 12:33 AM

I reckon to keep the l/w ratio at 17:1 which allow 800mm at the
waterline with a 15m length. I wouldn't lie to make the bows any
taller, Ther ies plenty of hydrostatic lift on a pretty good lever arm
to keep the boat flat. extra height is only extra windage and wave
punching resistance. It doesn't really need to be any more than a tri
outrigger bow. A ww flare of 400-600mm the base at 300-400mm below the
crossbeam, blending into the bow by half way through the rudder
supports. A bit like sodebo main hull. I wouldn't go quite so tall as
you suggest. I am nearly 6'4'' and at sea am quite happy at 5'10''
because of the wider stance at sea.. It also allows an extra point of
bracing, being able to jam ones head on the roof. I demand a full
length bunk though! It was agony in a bunk on an ex Japanese tuna
boat. Bunks can start half way up the flare as the mattress takes up
some of the depth. This gives nearly a meter headroom in the bunk and
room to let the legs splay. This splay room adds significantly to the
effective width of the bunk.
On the ww hull, I like the idea of a bump to ww and a bevel to lw but
am wary about lifting the roof ecept for maybe a perspex dome over the
steering. The floor of the bridge deck area can drop from the bunk as
it goes into the saloon and further as it reaches the center of the
saloon. This area is out of the wind and also protected to a large
extent from waves, provide we don't go to far into the center. A pop
top like on Aroha is possible for when anchored or not going to ww.
The cross bunks can take less room if they are allowed to protrude
under the seats of the saloon. I made a cardboard mock up and it was
possible to reduce the space taken up by about 20-25cm, providing
there is shoulder room to roll over. If I can fit, most can. This is
as far as I can go while keeping to the spirit of the long light boat
with minimum windage.
To go further, another concept is to make the crossbeams large enough
to take the bunks a la Val tris. Or for a compact boat, even going to
a monocoque construction with a center cockpit and a pod. It would
lose some of the benefits of the long light boat but could still have
the bulk of the wtww and the extra lw hull lengths and unstayed rig

maybe people are building or sailing rather than procrastinating like me,
Robert--- In, "jjtctaylor"
<jtaylor412@...> wrote:
> Hi Robert,
> I think we are stuck with the windage issue for the top enclosure
for those of us in the
> less mild climates. I agree the LW hull is a bit narrow for almost
anything. At 50 feet LW
> hull for Visionarry is 3 feet wide. I think close to that would be
a more prudent design.
> Adds flexibility as you put it for bunks & such. I did change the
beziers to see how it
> would look. Beyond 32" wide the LW hull loses it's sleek appearance
and begins to be
> dumpy, a little over-wide. But just my opinion.
> The LW hull is a bit short on the current design. Max height of
only 66 inches and much
> less over much of it's useful area. So I bumped the max up to 75
inches and added a few
> toward the bows to keep the slope and transitions in alignment. I
don't have the HP plans
> set. Only have the Visionarry. So don't know the internal bulkhead
spacing. Visionarry
> after I had the LW redesigned for me had bulkheads about every 6
feet or so. Would be
> nice if loads are not so great to leave the space open between mast
and beam. (Over 7
> feet) That makes the extra bunk idea a reasonable request.
> Pushing the helm to the lee side is not a great idea. Some
trade-off to have the enclosed
> cockpit. Still need to see the bows when parking, not good to bump
something unaware,
> so checked line of sight. Sure you can look thru the salon windows
but most will have tint
> to keep out the heat, so not good in lower visibility situations.
> I used your suggestion for reorienting one bunk under the extra seat
area. Good idea.
> Works great, now makes the salon big enough for proper lounging. I
still kept the other
> bunk in the fore-aft orientation cause definitely need space for
anchor stuff. I don't need
> propane tanks….. I am all-electric. Small genset for electric
cook, air conditioning, and
> electric DC drive. Battery technology is fast reducing weight so
trade a few gallons diesel
> for some extra batt power. Regen when have the opportunity.
> If you have interest I took the sail off and tried rigid wings as an
alternative. Really fun,
> cause it reduced the mast elevation from over 60 feet above
waterline to 43 feet, for
> similar sail area. Aroha has a really tall lightning rod for a mast.
> I never thought much about taking the boat apart. WE have so few
built and not seen that
> capability in my Visionarry plans. Looks like a real bugger of a job!
> Have a some more sketches if interested. Doesn't stir much interest
in our chat group.
> Must be on vacation for Easter.
> Regards,
> JT
> --- In, "Robert" <cateran1949@> wrote:
> >
> > G'day JT,
> > I like the idea of the bump to ww. The only objection is the extra
> > width of the hull and difficulty if needed to be taken apart for
> > towing. Enclosing the cockpit is a mixed blessing as it moves the
> > steering station towards the centre and slighltly increases windageand
> > weight. I also looked at flaring the inside of the lw hull to increase
> > the bury of the crossbeams and give a 3/4 bunks for extras at anchor
> > or inshore cruising. I have had a go at having the bunks across with
> > feat under the outside seats and thus extending the saloon by about a
> > meter or so. It means finding extra space somewhere else for the
> > Robert
> > --- In, "jjtctaylor" <jtaylor412@> wrote:
> > >
> > > I uploaded a concept layout for an extended HP to 13M. (HARRYPROA
> > > The design is intended to satisfy coastal cruisers in areas not so
> > mild as AUS. The intent
> > > is to have comparable or better interior roominess to a 30ft mono,
> > while delivering the
> > > spirited performance of the HP design.
> > >
> > > It extends the "extended" design with the WW hull at 30.1 feet and
> > leeward hull at 42.65
> > > feet (13M). Fit it altogether with the beam at 22.5 feet. See
> > sketch, in the FILES area of
> > > the group site.
> > >
> > > Major changes is bump out toward WW side to gain some interior space
> > and raise hull
> > > height on WW hull by 6.75 inches, to keep 6ft+ headroom. Enclosed
> > the seating area for a
> > > true salon, albeit small.
> > >
> > > I show two closed cabins, one is ensuite with head. The other has a
> > washbasin. The
> > > berths are more than generous, almost queen sized. The cabin with
> > washbasin still has
> > > some modest encroachment under the salon seat for legroom. The
> > ensuite has no
> > > problem.
> > >
> > > Without gaining even more length & beam it will be challenged for
> > walking space thru
> > > salon and galley. I don't see it as a problem, but appreciate input
> > and suggestions.
> > > Anyway hopefully a good talking paper to a get a decent cruiser
> > under a modest budget,
> > > while still having a reasonable set of comforts.
> > >
> > > I think the lines still look clean but may be wrong in my opinion.
> > Thanks for any
> > > comments and suggestions !
> > >
> > > Regards,
> > >
> > > JT
> > >
> >

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