Subject: [harryproa] Re: First pass at 12' beam for slip and restricted trailering
From: Mike Crawford
Date: 6/24/2008, 5:44 PM
To: harryproa@yahoogroups.com.au
Reply-to:
harryproa@yahoogroups.com.au


  I'll be the first in line to praise the schooner rig.  There are many benefits beyond the lower center of effort.

  However, unless you plan to tack most of the time, you'll spend a lot more time pulling strings on a schooner rig when compared to an easyrig or una rig.  There are also arguments against the schooner regarding additional drag and the problem of one sail shadowing the other on some points of sail.

  For your trailerable, I see three main questions:

  - How much work do you want to do while sailing?

  - How often do you want to hit or exceed 15 knots?

  - Are you willing to reef?


  If you want to minimize the work done during each shunt, a single rig will save you a lot of effort.  It will also probably speed tacking as well, since you won't have to fiddle with the aft sail to get the right balance and speed. 

  Assuming you aren't going to be racing, there's really no need to be too concerned about a higher center of effort.  Sure, you could potentially \make up for the narrower beam with the lower center of effort of a schooner rig, but that might not be necessary.  A single rig should still drive you to 10 to 15 knots with good wind, and most of the time, that's enough.  Losing a knot or two off your top end probably isn't too much of an impact for most sailing.

  Personally, I enjoy hitting 15+ knots a few times a year, but most of the time I'd rather sail between five and ten knots.  Ten knots is still fast enough easily outdistance most monohulls, and the breeze in your face is still pleasant.  15 knots of boat speed often means over 20 knots apparent wind, and that's not quite as relaxing.  Slower is also better If you have to dodge crab pots or boating traffic.

  The single rig would actually enhance your low wind performance, since you'll have more sail area high off the water, and often that's the only place you'll find any wind on a really low wind day. 

  The key is being willing to accept that the boat will fly a hull at lower wind speeds, and then reef accordingly.  I tend to favor a boat that is over-powered, but well-reefed, to a boat that is more stable with all its sails up.  You can always reef an overpowered boat and sail safely.  And when those really low winds appear, it can be nice to have that extra sail area.  But that's just me.  There are many arguments to stick with a safer boat.

  Regardless, being willing to reef really is the big question.  If you don't want to reef, or refuse to reef, go with the lower center of effort.  If you don't mind reefing (and no one should mind reefing), then the higher center of effort shouldn't be an issue.

  But imagine the massive amount of sail area you could get with *two* 40' masts...  ;-)

       - Mike



Gardner Pomper wrote:

I was wondering if a schooner rig would work better for a restricted beam like this. The shorter masts would give a lower center of effort and reduce the heeling moment for the same propulsive power, wouldn't they?

Thanks,
- Gardner


On Tue, Jun 24, 2008 at 11:43 AM, gardnerpomper <gardner@networknow.org> wrote:

Hi,

Some feedback from members on the trailerable design I had uploaded got me to thinking
about how much I actually wanted to trailer the boat myself, and how much I just wanted
the ability to get it from one side of the country to another without having to go through
the Panama Canal. I realized that my priority was to be able to get it into a slip, have a
travel lift haul it out for repairs/winter storage and potentially to have it shipped to the
Great Lakes or overseas. All of these work fine with a 12' collapsed beam, so I took
another look at my layout and eliminated the collapse to 8'6" and uploaded the result to
the files area under "barely trailerable" and "barely trailerable front".

This simplified alot. The beams do not have to be removable. The rudders can be
permanently mounted on that larger beam. The hardtop does not have to collapse, or fold
back on itself. I can slightly lengthen the ww hull and I can use wheel steering. The lw hull
does not need removable bows.

In addition to the great simplifications, I can now sleep twice the number of people (6
instead of 3) and seat 8 in a single level cockpit.

I still have some concerns. If anyone has opinions on them, I would love to hear them.

1) This is a Visionarry size boat (32' ww hull, 50' lw hull) with only a 20' beam. How will
that effect the sailing. My primary sailing conditions are 5-10 kts. I rarely sail in winds
above 15 and almost never above 20.

2) Where do I store the tender when the boat is collapsed in a slip?

3) How do I get aboard the boat from the water?

4) My 2nd double is difficult to access. I have planned an opening hatch in the cabin roof,
but that is awkward and potentially a source of leaks.

As always, feedback is appreciated.

- Gardner
York, PA


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