Subject: Re: [harryproa] First pass at 12' beam for slip and restricted trailering
From: "Gardner Pomper" <gardner@networknow.org>
Date: 6/24/2008, 10:12 PM
To: harryproa@yahoogroups.com.au
Reply-to:
harryproa@yahoogroups.com.au

I plan on using the boat with just my family (2 adults and a pre-teen). The 2nd double will probably be storage mostly, but makes it easy to have another couple visit briefly.


The weight is actually a really big question in my mind. I just checked the harry website and was stunned in the difference in weight betweeen the harryproa and the visionarry. For a relatively small increase in size (1m ww, 3m lw and 2m beam), the weight quadrupled (from 1764lbs to 6720lbs). Just on my very raw estimate of 1lb/sq ft for the fiberglass sandwich, I get about 2000 lbs for just the hulls and deck on this 12' "trailerable". If I add in a mast (150lbs?) an outboard (150lbs), 2 batteries  (150lbs each) and an extra 500lbs for head, stove, refrigerator, etc, I get a bare weight of 3000 lbs, less than half of visionarry's. Can you give me a better estimate of weight?

What is the height off the water of Rare Birds's mast?

For this layout, I am not greatly concerned with the drama of trailering. If it ever gets trailered, it will be by a professional boat transport company. This one will most likely get moved on the water, or on a boat transport ship.

When you mention that the hull flying speed should be 20+ knots, that means that I can safely sail with higher winds by reefing, correct?

I gather you have done a lot of sailing, but your must be very different from mine, because you say that mostly it will be done on reaches. I can tell you that most of mine is done to windward!! Sometimes I think all of it is! <grin>. Seriously, the sail down the Bahama island chain to the Carribean is all close to the wind.

I know that I have been throwing alot of drawings up, but I think that this (or something very similar) is the one I will end up going with. It seems to provide the best compromise between living space and the practicality of putting it in a slip until I can go sailing for real. The biggest question is going to be the cost of having it built (and where I am going to get the money!!)

- Gardner

On Tue, Jun 24, 2008 at 9:10 PM, Rob Denney <harryproa@gmail.com> wrote:

G'day


>
> I still have some concerns. If anyone has opinions on them, I would love to
> hear them.
>
> 1) This is a Visionarry size boat (32' ww hull, 50' lw hull) with only a 20'
> beam. How will
> that effect the sailing. My primary sailing conditions are 5-10 kts. I
> rarely sail in winds
> above 15 and almost never above 20.

20' should not be a problem Hull flying wind should still be above
20 knots.

>
> 2) Where do I store the tender when the boat is collapsed in a slip?

On the cabin top, on the marina, or tied up astern.

>
> 3) How do I get aboard the boat from the water?

Fold down ladder, ramp or part of the tramp. Could also have steps
recessed into the lee side of the lee hull, which helps getting on and
off at the marina.

>
> 4) My 2nd double is difficult to access. I have planned an opening hatch in
> the cabin roof,
> but that is awkward and potentially a source of leaks.

Decent hatches don't leak, and there should not be solid water hitting
it so you will get away with less than an expensive one. The
awkwardness is a function of jamming a lot into a small space. Unless
you regularly plan to have plenty of visitors, I would use a deck tent
or a motel for the extras. 6 people sleeping on a boat is easy. 6
people living on a boat for any length of time is not.

Schooner rigs are great, but almost twice the cost and work of a
single rig. Ballestron fits in the middle somewhere. Schooners are
great on reaches, which is where you will most often be sailing, less
good upwind, except in decent breeze. They also make shunting easier
the first few times, after which it is simple no matter what rig you
have. Whether you can get enough sail area with a sub 65' mast will
depend on the weight of the boat. Trailing a 65' mast is a lot more
drama than trailling two x 50' masts. 2 x 40' masts will fit in a
container. Telescoping or two piece masts will solve both of these
problems. Decisions, decisions!

regards,

Rob
>


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