A biharry gives more sail area down low which is good in a blow, except that as the boats are pretty light, you rarely need more sail when it is windy. When you do need more sail is in the light, and then the higher it is the stronger the wind. Two masts are twice the hassle, weight and cost, and the ww one will take up cabin space, although with back/fore stays it can be mounted on the cabin.
Stays from the top of the mast casue the mast to bend in the middle when a gust hits, which increases the force from the sail. No stays, or 3/4 height stays allow the top to fall away, reducing the power. Stays severely limit your options if you are accidentally caught aback. Fore/back stays can cause a capsize while with athwartship stays you end up sailing running before it to get back on course. Can be a problem in a breeze if you have not rotated either or both rudders. You have to keep them central or they will rotate and probably break, but you need to turn them to get back on course. I would make sure the stays can be easily released under load if required.
Stays will help keep the mast straight, but they add a large downward component. Make sure the hull under the mast is plenty strong.
Keep the trip stories coming.
rob
On Mon, Jun 14, 2010 at 8:16 PM, Doug Haines <doha720@yahoo.co.uk > wrote:
From: Rob Denney <harryproa@gmail.com >
Subject: Re: [harryproa] Re: south coastDate: Monday, 14 June, 2010, 17:18
Great effort so far. Hope the next leg is a bit less traumatic. Don't forget it is now winter and that you are in a particularly nasty bit of the world, weather wise.
Sol is progressing slowly as I am still fixing a couple of bright ideas which weren't and have been waiting for the big table to be finished for the mast, which it now is. Also doing the drawings for a similar one which we might be starting to build in a couple of weeks.
rob
On Mon, Jun 14, 2010 at 3:55 PM, Doug Haines <doha720@yahoo. co.uk> wrote:
Date: Monday, 14 June, 2010, 11:45
You may find that you need the flares,etc legally so it is probably not a bad idea as the fines are liable to be more tha the costs of purchase.
You managed to sort it out yourself and generally have the understanding and ingenuity to sort most things out. Yo Are learning the limits of your boat. You are now one of the more experienced Harryproa sailors and have sailed a significant part of the coast of WA. I have learnt a lot from the way your boat handles and where things need to be beefed up against awkward loads.
Much after Esperance, you'd need, self steering, large quantities of stimulants, a sea anchor or someone else to do some steering. In a smal boat you don't wnat to be out there during anything nasty.
I sketched a self steering windvane system for a multihull using a drag device made from a bibbed fishing lure to adjust for speed through the water affecting the apparent wind
--- In harryproa@yahoogrou ps.com.au, Doug Haines <doha720@...> wrote:> To: harryproa@yahoogrou ps.com.au
>
> Hi Robert,
> Â
> I have had a look and see what I think you may have meant about sand dunes and beaches from here to Esperance. After the huge cliff and boulder country of the capes and southern most part of WA, it curves back upwards (North), and the map shows a lot of long sandy stretches. This has slightly interested bme in Making for Esperance. So if the weather suits, then sailingshould not be such labour intensive. One should relax and be tired but noit sore at the end of the day.
> I finished repairs to mast. Now shorter. The problems started off Denmark. It was a halyard pulley wheel pin. It was a fibreglass pin holding the bpulley wheel. That disintegrated or sheared through and so the pulley went somewhere, probably floating away (or sinking), and the main halyard came down.
> I was doing a very nice broad reach at up arount 8-10 knots and oncourse for a quick and easy day with only another 40nm to go.
> While standing up at the mast some \very \quick short chop set the boat rocking side to side and broke the mast.
> I sailed with the mast lifting pole with a halyard at the top. I got about 2.5 knots.
> I don't have a radio, flares or Epirb.
> Do nyou think I should get any?
> I was unlucky though. The weather was easy, and that situation with swell backwashing from rockfaces and jostling the boat is not very common from where i come from.
> Also losing the halyard pin is not expected either.
> So was i inexperienced. Or was I ok since i got in eventually.
> Doug
> Â
> Â
>
> --- On Sat, 29/5/10, Rob Denney <harryproa@.. .> wrote:
>
>
> From: Rob Denney <harryproa@.. .>
> Subject: Re: [harryproa] Re: Predicting performance?
> Date: Saturday, 29 May, 2010, 19:58
>
>
> Â
>
>
>
> Sailed on James' junk rigged proa in NZ today. Went very well. A solution (not the one used by James, whose sail has a lot of twist) to the sheeting angle conundrum may be to put up a backstay and run the sheetlets to pulleys tied to it. The sheetlets can then be lead down to the deck and to the helmsman. Less drag as you have one big bundle, rather than a bunch of little ones, and the pull is horizontal instead of near vertical.Â
>
> Also sailed the first of the Chinese built harriettes. Build quality and finish are top class, the finish in particular is better than any moulded boat, but the boat was not test sailed before it left China so the sailing details were not well sorted.   Nothing that can't be fixed. Despite this, once I got it going, it was footing as quickly as the bigger, more powerful junk rig.Â
>
> rob
>
>
>
> On Sat, May 29, 2010 at 1:56 PM, robert <cateran1949@ yahoo.co. uk> wrote:
>
>
> Â
>
>
>
>
> I had a good look at the sheeting arrangements. They sheet way back to the stern. This would not really go with the Harryproa configuration of sheeting back to the ww hull. Posssibly sheet back to a pulley midway betweent the two bows. I suspect the hinge would have to be made extra strong to handle the different sheeting arrangements. If the timber wishbones were skinned with some carbon tow, they should handle the extra loads. It would probably be worth it aiming for an optimum leeward shape.
> I don't particularly like the wrinkles on the ww side. Possibly cutting the sails on the bias could smooth things.
>
> I am concerned about the sheeting angles. Hopefully Gardner can sort it out before I commit.
> regards,
> Robert
>
>
>
> --- In harryproa@yahoogrou ps.com.au, Mike Crawford <jmichael@> wrote:
> >
> > Robert,
> >
> > << you could get away with rice bags and still have a reasonable shape>>
> >
> > Precisely! I'm not sure if it would be a premium racing rig, but
> > while cruising, it seems to me that the average sail shape, particularly
> > in light winds, would be superior to a bermuda rig.
> >
> > To get the right sail shape with a single skin takes time, in terms of
> > adjusting leech/outhaul/ vang (no vang with fixed boom), and money, in
> > terms of sail cloth, track, and battens.
> >
> > Plus, the battens that work at 40 knots will be to stiff for five
> > knots, and the battens that work at five knots will be too flexible for
> > 40. I'm tired of yanking on my boom to get the battens to switch over
> > in light winds. I like to sail, but I'm not the kind of guy who would
> > keep three sets of battens on hand in order to have just the right
> > strength for the day's winds. So I have a medium-stiff set that
> > functions in all winds, but really isn't good for light or heavy weather.
> >
> >
> > <<The strings need not be a big source of drag with dyneema but one
> > would need some gloves.>>
> >
> > Agreed. Though I'd probably try to use dyneema on all the individual
> > lines, feeding into a single wider-diameter mainsheet (one shet per bow,
> > of course) that would be easier to handle and cleat.
> >
> >
> > <<Some people swear by junk rigs and this makes more sense to me than a
> > straight junk.>>
> >
> > Particularly if you want to go upwind. I'll daysail much more often
> > than I go cruising, so going upwind is a big deal. A friend of mine
> > says one spends 70% of one's time sailing upwind, and I have to agree.
> > If I just go out and back for the day, the windward phase is noticeably
> > slower, and covers a lot more distance, than the leeward phase.
> >
> > - Mike
> >
> >
> > On 5/27/2010 7:29 AM, robert wrote:
> > >
> > >
> > > Hi Mike
> > > I am with you on this rig: you could get away with rice bags and still
> > > have a reasonable shape; the sheet loads are lighter; it's easily
> > > reefable; if the top section rotted out, it would be easy to replace
> > > without wrecking the lines of the sails; there's no sail track to buy
> > > or jam; and the battens can be low tech. The strings need not be a big
> > > source of drag with dyneema but one would need some gloves. I will
> > > have to make up my mind before I start trying to set up for making the
> > > masts. A simple tapered section makes the most sense and it wouldn't
> > > need the bearings of a lot of other rigs.
> > > Apart from not being common I am not sure what the problems with it
> > > are for a cruising rig. Some people swear by junk rigs and this makes
> > > more sense to me than a straight junk.
> > > Robert
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
>
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