Just in case you hadn't seen this:
http://www.proboat.com/talk-radio.html
Eric talks about his unstayed masts here,
but it's nothing that you hadn't already known about.

I keep referring back to those drawings you sent me.
I've been pouring thru my old Multihulls Magazines
and so between what I got everything gets a new view
from another angle depending on what I looked at last.
I might even have yet another folding idea .....

Actually I kind of like the flat bottom idea .....
In my home waters, where most of the sailing will be done anyway,
I got a lot of skinny water!

KSS: I got the DVD and cd and it was helpful,
but far from showing a complete system.
I saw your videos, it's very inspiring
but still don't have enough info to try this out myself.
A KSS workshop might be the plan to fast track my abilities?
And when I do test sections,
Is there something I could actually make
that would be useful? Say a bulkhead or hatch cover or such?

Rigs: I like the schooner rig!
If you'll remember I had a biplane rig for my cat.
One big rig will be just too much to mount/demount solo!
.... and that's one reason for going with two smaller rigs.
While I like the idea of the telescoping masts
I still don't have a really good idea how to do that,
and it adds complexity , and maybe too much for my ufc usage.
In eric's blog radiocast he did mention an idea using the stub mast
and keeping any water out of the boat, cool ......
I also like your idea about the boom on a stub mast,
and if I can add a roller furling to the boom
then when I demount the mast all the sails would be neatly stored
and ready to be launched again.
It's something between Wizard's method and the Hoyt rig.
I'll have to model it soon and get a better idea of this
which would also be easier in presenting this concept.

I realize I'm playing catch up with all you guys
and I thank you for have the patience in dealing with all my "green-ness"!
Hopefully there are others that will also be inspired by this learning experience of mine?

--- In harryproa@yahoogroups.com.au, Rob Denney <harryproa@...> wrote:
>
> The folding method in the video works for long, skinny rocker less hulls.
> The design process is pretty simple as it is mostly straight lines. This
> also makes it easy to lay out the panels. It is no good for a boat which
> is comparatively heavy or tacks, which requires the extra work on the KSS
> system. We have found that skinny round bilge hulls are more difficult to
> fit bulkheads, bearings etc in so have moved to flat bottomed hulls
> unfused in simple mdf moulds. This method could be used for a cat.
>
> A flat bottomed hull can be lower/lighter, is just as fast (see Rick's drag
> curves in the Files section) and the bulkhead landings, beam and mast
> fittings are all included in the infusion. It can easily be built in two
> halves with a male/female join (also included in the infusion) along the
> full centreline or topsides. It uses cheap mdf moulds instead of a table.
> This method is being used on a 10m/22' high performance camper. It is a
> little more work than the bent flat panel to make, but the fitting out and
> joining are very quick and simple. Tear off the peel ply, put glue in all
> the slots and push it together.
>
> There are length limits in Aus, they differ between states, and they are
> being reduced. I have towed 12m/40' hulls but the problem is not the law
> so much as getting round corners.
>
> I only suggested folding ends for your boat to allow it to be portaged
> easily. For a non portage racer, the extra weight is unnecessary. The
> other big problem, length wise is the mast. Hence schooner rigs and/or two
> part masts.
>
> rob
>
> On Wed, May 23, 2012 at 10:34 AM, Dennis <spidennis@...> wrote:
>
> > **
> >
> >
> > Thanks guys for the responses, and I've been chewing on what was said.
> >
> > What is really cool is I got my two of my favorite designers together on
> > my post!
> > So when they speak, I gotta listen and absorb .....
> > I'm really new to proas, and I'm NOT a boat designer so it's all a
> > learning process!
> >
> > As for the width, I'll be making the hulls folding, somehow.
> > I'm still leaning towards my center platform system but other ideas have
> > been suggested for me to still reconsider, everything is a compromise so I
> > just have to figure out what features are most important and on the down
> > side just what can I live with.
> >
> > I have a whole pile of old Multihulls magazines from 20 years ago that I'm
> > going back over and it seems like most of everything has been already tried
> > to some extent, some things catching on and others left and forgotten, for
> > awhile anyway until someone else drags it back into the light of day. All
> > good stuff! Ran across an issue with lots of proas in it. Nov/Dec'97, and
> > read about Rob's "U". Years of development done by various
> > builders/designers so it's all something to take notice of.
> >
> > So back to the bows ....... (and hull shape) .......
> > whatever it is it still needs to be built so it has to conform to the
> > building techniques that I'll use.
> > In another of my recent threads I was talking about the KSS system and it
> > seems now others on different threads have also caught interest in the
> > subject. Maybe because of the two KSS workshops? Anyway, I'm trying to
> > learn more about it, doing my homework so to speak before the class (if I
> > can get to it). What I had not seen in any KSS info was what Rob did in his
> > video, and that was building the entire hull in one flat go, then bending
> > it in half to create the hull, then adding the deck. For some reason I
> > really like that idea but it sounds tough in designing? Before that, and
> > the KSS stuff I've recently re introduced myself to I was thinking about
> > stripping the hull out in either wood or foam then glassing over. I'm
> > teaching myself stripping on a canoe project I'm doing right now.
> >
> > Anyway, I got lots of learning yet to do so I'll be asking all the dumb
> > questions!
> >
> > Rob, here's a question for you. In our past discussion about the ufc proa
> > you mentioned about folding the ends. In some related boat reading about
> > big multi man outrigger canoes I heard that to be legal on some roads "down
> > under" that the boats couldn't be that long on the roads and had to be
> > folded in? Here in the USA that's not a problem so I'd not have to design
> > that feature in. It did help give me the idea of the "change out bows"
> > concept though!
> >
> > ok, now to just throw this out there, ........
> > What shape of main hull would you like to see and why?
> > Remember, this is mostly a UFC boat and my other idea is a biplane beach
> > cat,
> > so spartan living conditions are expected, it's a racer, not a liveaboard.
> >
> > --- In harryproa@yahoogroups.com.au, Carlos Solanilla <carlosproacarlos@>
> > wrote:
> > >
> > > When you design the proa, please look at the limit in Placida bridge,
> > mind you not the height, is 6 ft, but the width. With a 30 ft proa i
> > imagine the width is quite large
> > >
> > > Also there is 100 percent change you will get stucked in mud a couple of
> > times, so draft is important, and my guess is that cross section is also
> > important to get out of the mud
> > >
> > >
> > > Sent from my iPad
> > >
> >
> >
> >
>