Subject: Re: [harryproa] Re:: Exhilarator 40
From: "Rob Denney harryproa@gmail.com [harryproa]" <harryproa@yahoogroups.com.au>
Date: 10/3/2015, 7:31 AM
To: harryproa@yahoogroups.com.au
Reply-to:
harryproa@yahoogroups.com.au

 



On Thu, Oct 1, 2015 at 6:04 AM, fvonballuseck@gmail.com [harryproa] <harryproa@yahoogroups.com.au> wrote:
 

fantastic work Rob & Steinar,

questions/thoughts

- in terms of complexity/cost - is this boat a lot cheaper/easier to build than the original Harryproa which has similar dimensions?

Significantly cheaper and easier.    A quick comparison of the hull construction.
Set up:
Old: Set up strong back and cut and erect 12 frames as accurately as possible, then check it is fair with a long batten and adjust if required.
New: Butt join 2 full length pieces of mdf or similar,  cut one in half lengthwise and shape the sides of the other, from 4 measurements.  Wrap the halves around the shaped piece, fillet the corners and seal it.  Lay a level across it and shim as required.

Shell:
Old: Screw and edge glue ~70 strips of timber to most of the frames, with 30 of them requiring fitted ends. Fill the screw holes, sand off any lumps.  Glass. Repeat.
New: Cut the dry materials and lay them in the mould.  None of the cuts are critical. Place spacers, extra reinforcing, rebates etc where required.  Add the plumbing and the vac bag.  Infuse. Repeat. 

Internals:
Old: Loft and cut bulkheads from ply.  Cut out doorways etc and seal all edges.  Fillet and tab in place, ensuring they are positioned correctly, level and straight.  Make doors etc to fit.  Cut and shape shelves, bunk tops, steps, fillet and tape in place.  Rout rebates for windows and hatches.  Make and glass in mast step and deck bearing.   Fill and fair all the added glass.
New: Bulkheads, shelves, bunks, doors etc are infused on a flat surface. They mostly have straight sides and radiussed corners, so cutting the foam is very simple and accurate.   Post infusion they are ready to be glued into premade slots in the hull.  No grinding, cutting or trimming of cured glass is required.

Assembly:
Old: Make blind joins for anything that can't be reached post join, join the two halves,incl glassing the overlap, fillet and glass the bulkheads, fill, fair and paint.
New: Glue the bulkheads, shelves etc into one half, then glue the other half to that.  All joins are slots or male/female so self aligning.   No filleting, glassing or fairing required.  Remove peel ply and paint.

Materials costs are similar, labour is about halved, waste (over 50% extra resin on a strip boat), dust and sticky mess from hand applying resin is almost eliminated.   Almost all of a strip plankbuild is done with wet epoxy or involves sanding, so gloves, suit, respirator etc is advised.  This compares with one pair of gloves per infusion, and another for the gluing.   

Where is the biggest difference (seems the cabin moved on top of the main hull and was redesigned)

Plus the hull sections (flat rather than rounded), schooner instead of ballestron, folding beams, more sail area, addition of the saloon/table/seats/galley up and usable space in the lee hull.    Minus the separate bunks.  

- daysailors  seem to be popular at the moment - from that perspective it would be interesting if the pop-top version could maybe also have just a canvas roof?

Add a couple of curved stiffening battens and it would be my choice for cruising  as well as day sailing.  Lighter, easier and cheaper but not as secure, which may or may not be a problem, depending on your usage.

Understand that cars and boats are not the same - but many cars now have 'roll-back'/ sliding convertible roofs which would make that interesting. Open seating with a group of 4-8; camping/cruising with a group of 4-5..

Interesting indeed, but automating the pop top is not very high on my list of priorities.  ;-)

- access to the main hull - think for cruising in colder environments we need to get rid of a lot of stuff (sleeping bags, clothing etc)  - maybe axes to the main hull and with some space under the seats/ in the  outer ends would be practical

Access hatches not shown on the renderings.

- folded - access to the side of the boat from the quay still has to work - can not judge from the renderings - does it?

As well as if it was not folded.  

BlindDate/Compaen just installed handle bars and steps on the outside of the hull to facilitate this.

They have a lot of passengers who are not very agile, but adding steps etc is not difficult, especially if they are included in the infusion.

- nice detail with the access to he LW hull - good for privacy but probably would also still allow extra bunk right?

Yes. Plus toilet/shower.

Steering - had the opportunity to steer BlindDate/Compaen recently - great experience. Must say the ability to move the boat 90 degrees sideways due to 2 rudders and a outboard turned was a new experience. Highly underestimated how useful that it is in a tight environment. are 270degrees rotating rudders still an option?

If you want them.  An outboard on a tube mount and lifted rudders will give the same effect. 
Any more comments on the new set up on Compaen?

thanks for the next level of inspiration.

Mostly Steinar, who is a joy to work with.  An example of 1+1=3.

Re internal steering and gadgets:   
While I personally would not have them on my boat, I don't have a problem with autopilots, mast mounted cameras, electric winches, etc as long as there are suitable back ups when they fail. 

I am not a big fan of inside steering in really bad weather, unless the boat is virtually hove to.  ie,  no chance of being surprised by big winds or waves.  My "near gale and sleet" response if cruising would be to drop the sails and go below, plus a drogue or anchor if close to shore.  If serious sailing was required (deadline, lee shore, etc), then wet weather gear and outside. 
 



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Posted by: Rob Denney <harryproa@gmail.com>
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