Subject: [harryproa] Re:: Infusion epoxy
From: Mike Crawford
Date: 5/10/2018, 1:18 PM
To: harryproa@yahoogroups.com.au, Jerry Barth

Jerry,

EPOXIES

  Link to products mentioned (not advertising -- just helping you find a purchase link amongst the confusing web pages):

    http://www.king-cart.com/cgi-bin/cart.cgi?store=epoxy&product=..Epoxies

  I've used the Premium No Blush as an adhesive and sealant so far -- frame sections to be glued-and-screwed, scarfs, laminates, etc.

    http://www.epoxyproducts.com/noblush.html

  This was before I started reading more about penetrating epoxies.  Being a plywood boat, the more I think about it, the more I'd like the epoxy to penetrate the surface as far as it can.  There will eventually be gouges and leaks, and while I'm using marine plywood, it's standard marine ply, not okume, so the more sealed I can get it, the better.  And if the penetrating epoxy is largely soaked into the wood (no pooling), and I apply the standard epoxy and fiberglass to the surface within 36 hours, it will yield a chemical bond as well as a physical bond.

  When glassing, I'll probably use a first layer of ESP 155:

    http://www.epoxyproducts.com/penetrating4u.html

  The useful information is waaay down on the page.  The basics:  it's a true cyclo-aliphatic no-blush resin with 24% solvent.  Other penetrating epoxies use cheaper resins and/or have a solvent content of 60% or more.  I've also included a quote from an email discussion with Mr. Oman following my signature.

  I'm might be able to get equivalent products from other vendors, but I like Oman's prices, and I also like the insane amount of detail he offers.  I know more about what I want after reading his manifestos than after doing other research, so I personally want to give him the purchase if I can.

    I'm not using a barrier coat other than the premium no-blush.  Oman started me on this path, but after looking at other options, I have to agree with him.  The mica flakes in traditional barrier coats might make them more resistant to water migration, but these coatings are also brittle, so once cracked due to hull flex, they'll lose their effectiveness.  So I'll go with a high-quality resin instead.  I /might/ even go with a flex-type epoxy as the outermost layer before bottom paint.

    http://www.epoxyproducts.com/barrier4u.html


ALUTHANE

  This stuff is pretty impressive. 

  We have a series of sand/salt barrels on our driveway, and after one season the shovels were just covered in rust.  After two seasons there were some big flakes and chunks, not just rusty patches.

  Since I was ordering some ESP 155, I figured I'd get a quart of Aluthane, too.  I wire-brushed the surfaces to remove flakes, wiped them down, and painted with a brush.  Attached is a photo of one of the shovels after having been used in the sand/salt for a season, and then used to dig out stumps for a few hours yesterday.  Pretty tough stuff.



  There are obviously places where rocks and tree roots have scraped off the paint, but that's to be expected with any coating.  What's impressive is that the paint was this sturdy given the lack of surface preparation.

  I can't say if the aluminum in it is inhibiting rust, but  its toughness and ease of application have earned it a spot on my shelf.

        - Mike

 

"No magic involved with penetrating epoxies, despite their claims. All the products are just solvent thinned epoxy, including our similar ESP 155. You can add solvent to any of the solvent free epoxies. The solvents soak into the wood and transport the epoxy with it. That is it.  Now the solvent free epoxies only have a surface bond so if you bond and fuse it to the solvent thinned base coat you get a resin system with a 'deeper' bond to the wood. On the other hand, adding solvent to the epoxies weakens their physical properties."



Jerry Barth shredderf16@sbcglobal.net [harryproa] wrote on 5/8/2018 7:27 PM:
 

Mike,
I'm gonna build a 15 foot Richard Woods tri in the next year, can you give an executive summary of your schedule of the Oman resins to coat your dory (sealing, laminating, etc). You're right, website looks like it has such a plethora of information as to be overwhelming. I do know now how to coat my shipping container on my property in St Thomas though!
Thanks,
Jerry Barth



On May 8, 2018, at 1:34 PM, "mcrawf@nuomo.com [harryproa]" <harryproa@yahoogroups.com.au> wrote:


  
<<Any recommendations for infusible epoxy?>>

 If you're in the US, I'm partial to Paul Oman's products at http://www.epoxyproducts.com/

  His website is about the worst imaginable, but he sells non-blushing cycloaliphatic resins for much less than the competition, and offers huge amounts of email advice, both on how to use the products and on which products to purchase.

  I'm using his premium no-blush on a 26' plywood dory, and as a first coat will be using the low-viscosity version to soak into the wood.  It will work like git-rot or the CPES penetrating epoxy, but have the added benefit of known compatibility with the rest of the layers.

  If I didn't go with Oman, I'd use System3.  I've met the guy who created the formulation and I like his priorities in terms of what he wanted to accomplish.

        - Mike

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Posted by: Jerry Barth <Shredderf16@sbcglobal.net>
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